Shooting Straight into High-Tech Training with Mantis X Insights

Speaker 1: 0:00

What's up everybody. It's Brian here on the Brew House and I'm really excited for a new show today because I have a guest with me that you know I've previously had interviews with, specifically firearms instructor and folks like that, but today is something a little bit different for you, and hopefully you'll find this not only entertaining but actually informative and you'll be able to get something out of it that you can use to improve your own shooting. So before we get going on the episode, though, I do have to give a shout out to the sponsor of this episode, and that is Alien Gear Holsters. If you are looking for any holster out there, if you don't have a favorite holster yet, this is about to be it, because they're unbelievably comfortable, they got amazing retention, they're easy to adjust and they got the like it Y'all I got to show you, because this is the, this is the cloak mod right here, and I love this thing.

Speaker 1: 0:55

I've been carrying Alien Gear for quite a while now, but I wanted to tell you about this because they have this whole new thing. It's called the Rapid Force Level 3 Duty Holster and it is actually designed for law enforcement, military, other security pros. It's got active retention, not just passive retention. So you know it's a lot safer to carry a fewer around other people who you may or may not know their intentions, but then it also if you're in law enforcement. It does have an optional axon signal sidearm mount. So if you're using one of those for video then you can actually have that included in the holster and it really works well. It's also got an extra large optics hood and a large light chamber for attack light. So you know, if you carry with that, then check out the Rapid Force Level 3 Duty Holster from Alien Gear. They currently have it on left or right hand draw for the Sig Sauer P320 line and then they also have it for the I think it's Glock's 1719, 22, 23, 45 and 47. So they're getting those pre-ordered right now for the Glock's but Sig Sauer's already available. So check out the link in the show notes of this episode if you want to learn more about it and all the other awesome Alien Gear holsters.

Speaker 1: 2:10

I've actually been carrying with them for almost 10 years now and again there's a reason why I don't stray, I don't go anywhere else because they are the best for me. That said, I'm going to jump into the episode here because I've got a guy with me who I think you're going to find not only entertaining but also has something really cool to talk about, and I'm looking forward to hearing his story. I have not heard his story yet, but we connected a while back via email. We've had some really good connection here and well, I'm just going to go ahead and jump in and say welcome to the show. Jake Hollenbeck from Mantis X how you doing what's?

Speaker 2: 2:47

up Brian how we doing Brewhouse team Just super stoked to be able to be here with you guys ready to jump in and talk some Mantis, gear and things in the industry and how are things going. So really stoked to be able to be here with you.

Speaker 1: 3:00

Dude, yeah, it's. I'm glad to have you, because I've been looking forward to this interview for a while. I think there was a week there that you weren't available and then a week that I wasn't available, and so we're finally making it happen here. I'm really excited for it.

Speaker 2: 3:16

I had a guest that week, which was a huge show right, really busy for us, and that was right after shots and it was just like this quick yeah. We each had a week and family were able to make that happen. So I was pretty happy to be able to link up with you and I've heard great things about the show, so I'm really excited to be here.

Speaker 1: 3:36

Thanks, man, we're glad to have you. So before we get going on the episode, I got asked have you ever used Alien Gear holsters?

Speaker 2: 3:42

Yes, yeah, I didn't want to jump in on that intro, but I actually wrote on a Cloak Tuck for my Cloak 17 and absolutely love it. It's super comfy, it's really well and they've got great ways to get it molded. So, whether they like you and suppress our headsets, all of that stuff fits in runs and they're really good I love using it all the time, believe it or not.

Speaker 1: 4:05

I. Actually there's been a couple times that I was wearing my. I've got the Cloak, tuck 3.5 and in waistband, super comfy and, believe it or not, there was actually a time where some friends of mine, we were hanging out and they said, hey, there's a group of group of guys and girls down here in Arkansas and they said, hey, what if we go line dancing? I forgot I was wearing the thing. It's that comfy and I'm not even like exaggerating. I literally forgot I was wearing this thing. So I'm like, okay, cool, that's awesome.

Speaker 1: 4:36

So we go out and we find there's this little country bar just down the road. It's not even a bar, it's literally some folks backyard. They built this shed and it's amazing. It's like a massive shed that they've dressed out as their own little shop and has a dance floor and all this stuff in it. Anyways, I did line dancing this thing and I'm like halfway through I'm like I'm okay, but there was no slip, there was nothing. There was no slip there was, there was no binding, there was no worry about it. It was nuts. I. There's a reason why I say why I've been carrying for 10 years and with alien gear and they're amazing.

Speaker 2: 5:14

But my big thing is you know, just like sitting in the car, driving, when I forget that I'm gonna get me in the car, I'm like man, I totally forgot how to go. I mean, like this thing is so comfy, it breathes well, you know, not like constantly sweating it out and stuff. It's yeah, they're really, really worth it.

Speaker 1: 5:38

Oh yeah, now quick preference question here Do you carry appendix side or back, or how do you? What's your carry?

Speaker 2: 5:45

I'm an appendix guy you know, I'm like everything in the industry that's mainstream on stuff. It's like a trend. You know what I mean. I can't know if it's trendy. I do it. It's for a reason too. You know it works, it's comfy, it's quick, it's accessible, yeah. So I think if you're doing it in the other way, you're behind the curve. That's just me.

Speaker 1: 6:09

I'm behind the curve. It's right here on my side, so, but that said, I did. I did see a great one the other day. There was an interview online and the guy says says, technically, if you think about it, if you're appendix, carrying every firearm is also a de-cocker.

Speaker 2: 6:33

You're going to roll into this, Jim that's right yeah. Yes, yeah, stop that interview. I was like boy.

Speaker 1: 6:41

And I love these little like pause and look at the camera. Well done, well done, so yeah. So tell us a little bit about yourself, man. I mean, obviously you're with Mantis X now, but tell us a little bit about who are you. Tell us a little bit about your upbringing, where you always raise your arms. Are you military, like what's? Tell us about yourself.

Speaker 2: 7:04

Yeah, so I grew up and well, I currently reside out in Kansas right now. I've always been kind of a great plans guy. I grew up in Blackfields. That's my upbringing and my whole life up there. You know it was a Cronhorn hunting, mule, deer White tail. I've been doing guns my whole life. I'm a military. High school I did, unless in the army. I was in the army for four years. I wonder how the country looked like, obviously, and that's where we started for the professionals.

Speaker 2: 7:45

I did software while I was in the army. So as soon as I got out I was kind of bouncing between software companies for a couple of years. I did for a while and then Mantis came along with a opportunity for me to come on and ship for five months and software together and we just kind of clicked, click like a click, click like a key from there. You know it was one of those deals where it's like all those six billion was in the military and love guns so let's just make this work. So you know, always been big on him. You know always been a rank one shotgun for me. And then obviously, once I became a man and also it's like, okay, might be time for some pistol action and it's falling down.

Speaker 1: 8:37

And now you know, I don't know the metal all the time around the clock.

Speaker 2: 8:41

What am I gonna get my hands on? I'm gonna shoot and put Mantis on it and talk about it. So that's kind of where it started. You know how we got to Mantis and then. So for for the team I do Kansas territory sales. I'm always doing shows. Like I said, I was at the Great American Outdoor show and PA a couple weeks ago. I'm sure before that we've got a lot of big ones coming up for, like an actual guy in law enforcement stuff. So that's cool, stay really busy, yeah.

Speaker 1: 10:05

Man, that's awesome. Yeah, no, that was funny because I think, yeah, because we, you had just gotten back from shot Whenever we were connecting and this is like okay, let's, let's, let's, let's set something up here. How was I mean? Obviously it's kind of funny to think about how, dare I say liberal, the city of Vegas is right, but then you have this massive gun show that rolls in and surprisingly, there's no activity. Right, that's, it's crazy.

Speaker 2: 10:36

It is. It's super strange we always kind of have like maybe the new age of big city women.

Speaker 1: 10:42

You know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 10:44

And yeah, no, it's crazy how all these other bins and all these big things and all these shit rolls are like thousands of thousands around and then you actually nothing happens. It's crazy how that works out, you know.

Speaker 1: 10:59

My AR has been sitting here next to me and I just keep an eye on it to make sure it doesn't go off and like shoot somebody, Because I know I know that they're notorious for just going out and killing people.

Speaker 2: 11:10

So they're all in legs and becoming murderers. They all think like this.

Speaker 1: 11:15

Yeah. So that said, man, I mean so. So yeah, you're you're. You said you're out in Kansas right now. What? Like? I grew up in Kansas myself, actually. So I grew up out in Southeast Kansas, so I know the area well and then of course had some, had some friends out in Hayes, kansas, out in the Western side, and, you know, had some workout in Colorado for a couple of summers. So, man, I tell you it's, I'm familiar with all of Kansas and I understand that the vast majority of it is black 90% of it is the exact same thing.

Speaker 2: 11:52

I said. I'll show you the same picture from the east end to the west end. It's, it's, yeah, it is. I'm on the White Hills, pretty close to pretty close to Manhattan. So I mean, you know we have some rolling prairies and creeks and like a wooded area. So it's not, yeah, I step out the door and I'm not like who court, but that's a walk away. So you know.

Speaker 1: 12:16

Oh well, let's roll into talking a little bit about Mantis here because, like I gotta say, I actually ran into Mantis. I was referred to Mantis by a friend of mine who actually I found out you know, and that's Kara Connery. She was the one on the episode before you here and yeah, so I guess she joined you guys for shot show and GAOS, I believe. So that's pretty awesome that you guys know each other. But she is the one who first introduced me to Mantis, because I was out at the range and I was relatively inconsistent with my shot, right, it was like I could do decent, but then there would there would be these random shots that are just like what did I do there? And I wasn't able to fully understand where I was going wrong.

Speaker 1: 13:08

What was you know? Was I, was I overcompensating by pushing and anticipating the shot? Was I squeezing to the left? I mean, you could obviously see where it was on the paper, but it was like, okay, but where's the breakdown? And so she started me on. She said you need the X10. And so, if you, I don't know if yeah, there you go. So there's the X10 right there and I started training with it and I gotta be honest, man, after I looked at the website the website you guys make a pretty bold statement on there. It says 94% of all shooters agree that they get better with Mantis X in just 20 minutes 20 minutes.

Speaker 2: 13:48

Yep, yep, so it is. It's bold, it's bold, it's a big claim. But in Tara she would say the same thing here, but we eat our own dog food at work. You know what I mean. It's kind of one of those deals where we've seen them on my own and stuff before I decided to like jump in and tell you what I'd always like. You know what feeling all up and down in my back then I'd been doing pistols for five years.

Speaker 2: 14:18

I get what's going on here. But this thing on and literally it's I mean, it's a big slice of humble pie. It's one of those deals where I was like man, holy cow, the amount of detail that it gives you. I mean, the learning curve is vertical. It's unreal how much it does really improve you right away. So it's a big claim, but you know, 94 out of 100 people would tell you it's very true.

Speaker 1: 14:47

So we kind of bring us around so where we started right, yeah, tell us about the kind of the roots of Mantis and what was the first thing they came out with, or how they say hey, I think we can make shooting better, you know?

Speaker 2: 15:00

Yeah, so the company was started by three brothers, one of them, or I think. At the time two of them were in the Chicago area and then two of them of the three are out in Utah, so there's a little bit of balance in looking for it. But basically they get together all the time and just look for good ideas to improve, you know, their lives, their surroundings, society, anything. So they do a lot of things that weren't just firearms, but all of them being out of shooters and telling about fire and safety. You know they were looking for a way to fill the void of looking for access to become more proficient, better trained shooters without having to pay thousands of dollars every year to travel the country to go to classes. So they were kind of thinking of how do we tackle this issue? Well, they all have engineering degrees from I think it's BYU. Don't shoot me if I'm wrong, but I think it's BYU.

Speaker 1: 16:04

I'm going to hold you to that. That's right. It's on the internet now, so it's real.

Speaker 2: 16:10

Hey, I know mechanical engineers right, that's what they've done. And it started with the idea of like, ok, how do we analyze what people are doing while they shoot? Right, we don't have the next hand. We shut off and recording things all the time and sending for something to look at or remote coaches, things like that. So what do we do here? This sort of motion came into play and vibration.

Speaker 2: 16:34

So they decided all right, I think the best way for us to tackle this is going to be with an accelerometer and gyroscope and, as an American, I don't know if any story when they're very first doing they tried to free this could be done. They basically jail broke a really old Android phone and just rubbed it on through a glove. They were using an accelerometer to make this work, yeah, and then once they realized, oh, we can read this raw data, we can turn the vibration and movement frequencies, depending on how you're shooting, and see what's going on. And then, basically, from there that's where it was born they started with the original Man2Sex. That was the first product, which is what we can see here. But it's this guy, ok, and compared to your X-Tain, you can tell it's like a massive LEGO brick, right yeah, this huge requires hardware and stuff. This was the original, though the OG is what we call it, so that's where it started.

Speaker 1: 17:35

It's smaller than an Android phone, though, so that's good yeah.

Speaker 2: 17:38

It's way easier to put on a gun than a phone is. There's no doubt about that. So they were like OK, we can get it attached to the firearm, let's link it up via Bluetooth to an app that we can write and create. That's the roots. I mean, that is where the seeds sprouted. That's where it all took off the first couple of years. We're collecting all the raw data and building the algorithms. It's a magic of whole operation. Is the algorithms of each fire number right? If you're shooting a live fire, dry fire, co2, or a shark, whatever you're going to mount it to, you want feedback from and then, once you've got that all tuned in, they apply all of that data to the age old pie chart of like. If your muzzle is going hard while you're pulling the trigger in your right hand, you probably have to put your finger finger in it when you're forcing that muzzle right. So as soon as they saw this, understood what the data meant and how to build the algorithms and sensitivity out from there.

Speaker 2: 18:40

That's when things really started ticking up and, ironically and luckily for the company, that was right before COVID when, like, we just released the new version of the sensors the X2 to the X10, and we still released some ERGs. That was going right into COVID, which obviously. Ranges were shut down, gun stores were shut down and it was hard to get out and do things and people were looking for a way to do dry fire at home. But as soon as we got into people's homes and everyone never said like, oh, this thing's nuts, I can do this dry and when I get the opportunity to go shoot I can take it with me. That's when we really just picked up a ton of steam and we're still just crazy busy trying to keep up with everything and release some new stuff. We've got some new cool things on the way. So that's kind of that's the roots. That's kind of where it came from and how we got started.

Speaker 1: 19:37

Yeah, dude, that's. I love it because you're right, it's. I think it's super easy. You know, a lot of people will think to go, oh well, I can obviously go to like an instructor or trainer or something like that. But then whenever it comes to time to actually execute on that right, and whenever you go, oh wait, that means I have to drive over here, that means I have to do this.

Speaker 1: 19:59

And you know, I've seen other systems where not gonna say names or anything but like where they, you know you set up a camera, like you're saying a slow-mo camera or something like that well, not everybody has access to a slow-mo camera, not everybody has access to an area that they could do it in. You know, whatever, there's a lot of complications, I think. And so something like this to have it at home, like I'm able to set up, and just do it really anywhere, right, Like I've done this, I've got mine actually set up. So I've got this and I got the laser academy, I've got it set up in my garage, so then that way I can just go out there and practice, train, do whatever, and I'm not bugging anybody. There's no risk with it.

Speaker 1: 20:43

You know, if I'm practicing, I know that you guys have the holster draw with the X10, so, like holster draw analysis, that's one of my favorite parts and actually that's why Carrie got me onto this, because she goes look, I want to get you to a one second draw, but you have to be accurate and you draw the first shot. You have to be accurate. Get the laser Academy, get the X-10, pair them together and then you can sit there and train and you know where you're hitting and you can see what your actual motion looks like. I think that's also insane, the amount of microscopic motions this thing picks up.

Speaker 2: 21:22

It's an eye-opener, right, you can go on the website and see all the videos and say, oh wow, I see a bunch of squiggly lines and it's all encoded and this is data right, and we're obsessed with data these days but the reality is it was an eye-opener when you got home, put it on your firearm and wait and did it and you're like, oh no, it's not, it's a force multiplier for instructors. We were never designed to replace instruction. It was get you up to speed, get the fundamental sharp, get a really good baseline. And that's what this is. Right, lance Armstrong, when he might be a bad example, but training for bikes and stuff, it was one of those deals where you had to have the fundamentals of how to sit on the seat, how to push the pedals right, what you're doing up and down, blah, blah, blah, blah. Great, this is a perishable skill, so we just want to get a good baseline fundamental side and then explore on it.

Speaker 2: 22:26

Are you competition shooters? Is this for defense? What are you doing here? It doesn't matter, because this applies to all of them. We've got all sorts of instructors out there that are like man. This is an awesome way to get people up to speed.

Speaker 1: 22:40

Well, and not only that, but I think one thing that impressed me too was, I mean, so whenever you get to your kit, right, I don't know if y'all can see it, yeah, so here's the kit. And so whenever I got my X10, so it comes with little shims and everything I love the fact that you can use it on all the different kinds of firearms, right. So, like, obviously, I think it's like the X2, you can't do certain things with, but the X10, I've got it, where I can actually hook this up to my AR. Anything with a pick rail, right, I can put that on there. But then it also includes, like, the shotgun adapter and everything. So, and then I think you guys even have an archery app, right.

Speaker 2: 23:22

Yeah, yeah, we. So the X10 will do literally anything. It goes pistol with the fuller shotgun, archery and for shotgun, and what Hand grenades yeah. I mean it's gonna get expensive. Yeah, it's awesome. Everything in the X10, you know, is like the adapters for pistols that are on rails. Yeah, you know. Any long gun that doesn't have a real system certainly is. It's designed for anything. Little buddy at work who you get a man to his son's rubber band gun and Nerf gun for his son to get started. It works on everything.

Speaker 1: 24:03

It's pretty real.

Speaker 1: 24:07

So, like here's the security nine, right, and so it literally is as easy as top, like that's it, it's on there and then you just, you know, power it on and everything. Again, I got to say I didn't know how well it would help me, right, because I'm definitely a skeptical person. I'm a person who, not just of this, but like of everything, I'm like, yeah, okay, like 94%, sure, I'm going to be in the six, but, right, I'm not. I'm definitely in the 94 because I'm going my scores, my accuracies, everything like that. I know there's also like a Facebook group where, you know, mantis owners will compete and like talk about, oh well, what's going on here? I'm having a disconnection problem. Well, are you running on this Bluetooth or what you know? Like, what phone do you have? Well, we've got issues with that phone because that phone sucks, and so it's not the Mantis, it's the phone, because that's a known issue or something. You know. So, but it's really cool, that's. That's another thing I think with Mantis that I've seen, not only on the Facebook side, but also even just talking with you and talking with my friends, experience with y'all.

Speaker 1: 25:18

It definitely is community. You guys are building community around something and, like you said it's for the everyday person, right, it's, for it's not going to make you the top dog, most excellent shooter in the world, because that and training like crazy will do that Well, well, but this is to get everyone up to speed and to take you into that really confident level, right. I mean, obviously, yeah, you can dial in a lot more of your shot, even if you are an expert. You can even still dial in. Everybody can get better. But, like, I'm just looking at this going, man, this is so great to use because it builds community. You have this like, how'd you guys do that? How did you go about building such a strong community? Because that's and that's not even on our show notes or anything here. But like, how did you do that?

Speaker 2: 26:09

Yeah, community was a was a big deal for us and I'm really glad you brought that up because in the app we have a social, there is a social in the. So, there, there are shooting groups out there who they share their scores, they push each other to competitions. They're there to support each other. But the idea of community was always was always written in. There was always a point of our software and a company mission. You know, our mission is to train a million shooters a year and it's really hard to do just one to one, right? Even if you think of, like, your local gun clubs, your local instructors, it is their own community, right? You know the people in your town or your city or whatever, and are taking this as classes or at least talking about this as a range or gun shop or whatever it is. You're constantly building.

Speaker 2: 26:59

That community is a huge part of of gun people, right, we have that's.

Speaker 2: 27:05

It's a very American aspect, right, but yeah, it's always been a big part of it is we share our experiences with each other and that's always been a big part of it.

Speaker 2: 27:14

That, combined with the fact that we're a software company, right, like, community has always been a big part of keeping people together, sharing things together, and that was kind of the point. So, yeah, that that, combined with the social thing that we've got going on with the app and, just like you said, you know we've got Facebook groups out there of people that are always sharing stories with each other, asking questions yeah, combined with, you know, our support team, our company, is fantastic with our customers. We want to be communicative, you know. We always want to talk about what's going on. We're always updating the app and if you ever have any kind of problem at all, reaching out to us is is going to be massively beneficial, because we love our people and we're always happy to help in any way we can. So, yeah, community was a big part of it, just in the initial stages of how we're going to do this thing.

Speaker 1: 28:11

Well, exactly, and, like you know, you mentioned just everything from your support team and all that I mean even in, even in setting this up, right, setting up the podcast episode. Yeah, I was working with Elise on that, and just shout out to her because she has been a dream to work with in helping out not only setting up the podcast but also getting me some more info and some different resources that I needed. Regarding you guys, because I want to do when I get something, I want to use it to the best, and so you know, I mean full disclosure. I'm an affiliate, but I actually bought my X10 myself, like that's my own jam and so, but I was just like dude, this is insane. And so I'm really hoping we'll talk about something here in just one second, because right now I'm primarily focused on pistol work, right, so like I kind of I'm elevating my schedule a little bit, kind of compressing it, but so right now I'm working on a lot of pistol work, but my goal is here, probably within March, to move up and start working on more rifle work, right, so I want to do some more like CQB stuff with my AR, but the thing is like I can actually put this on my AR as well and train with it, whether top mount, bottom mount, whatever, and you guys have a lot of really cool stuff.

Speaker 1: 29:37

But then you guys have actually come out with a system that's even better than just throwing the X10 on the AR. And this is what, dude I'm. I gotta be honest, I'm like I'm like a kid in a candy store for this one, and this is not made for promo, but this is like you get. Yeah, this is real authentic excitement right now, because I learned this next one, the Blackbeard X and the Blackbeard system that you guys built for this, and I want you guys to talk. I want you to talk a little bit about that, because I was like, okay, how do I make this work on my AR? And she's like you do know the Blackbeard system right, and I was like, yeah, the what yeah, so probably my favorite product of all this is this car right here.

Speaker 2: 30:26

This is the Blackbeard and I'm probably covered up by Mike. So how this works is it's a one to one. So you would drop your bulkhead the real pen, just like you normally would. You can see that there's it, which is that red plastic bit. You can see that there and the handle's molded too. It just slides right in there and then the magazine is the battery that powers it. You get that set up and you can hear that calibration noise. Yeah, it's a constant reset.

Speaker 2: 30:53

So I just put this guy boy on fire, I can actually squeeze and constantly reset my trigger over and over and over again. Your bad guy is insane, probably like most of our favorite disclaimers and things like that. As far as enjoying dry fire training is, with this guy right here, full charge, it'll do about 50,000 trigger presses.

Speaker 2: 31:20

Okay, it's the sensor that we were talking about, our X10. That same sensor is built into the magazine so you can link your app to the just the same way as you can. It's kind of laser in it, so you can use it in most of systems like laser academy and if you beat the property of rainfall it's going to still in there with it.

Speaker 1: 31:41

This thing is like it's over yeah.

Speaker 2: 31:47

I wish it was going to just whatever. It's right, it's really, really cool. It's a very cool system, very easy to use. In some portions it gamifies your training, but also, in the other hand, it works with the rate like the LAB 140 trigger. It's my, it's my furniture, it is my life. Yeah, it's just constant reset ability, which is insanely cool.

Speaker 1: 32:13

And that was going to be my next statement too, because I know a lot of people are probably concerned and I know again, I haven't shot with it yet, but I'm like you get to feel the real trigger weight Right, like it's your full trigger pull. So it's not like you're switching something out there, like it's the real reset for you, right.

Speaker 2: 32:33

Yeah, yep, exactly Yep, and just like you said, exact same reset. It is your life. Yeah, just constantly resets for dry fire. It's a very, very cool system. I should Well, I could pull it out and show you, but basically there's a little piston inside of that, okay, that sits right above the hammer, so every time you pull a trigger, that goes up and then it just forces it in place, gotcha.

Speaker 1: 33:01

Okay, well, that makes sense. Yeah, I mean because I saw Colin Noir actually doing his little video, his review Of the Blackbeard system, and I thought it was really good because he was very, very honest about it. You know, like he mentioned it, he talked about some of the things he likes. There was, like, I think, one or two little hesitations. He said it wasn't like a red flag for anything, it wasn't like a no, it was just like, oh well, that's different than I expected, you know. And so, but to hear him you know I highly respect his opinion in the shooting world, I would love to have him on the show someday, that'd be amazing. But also like just to hear him actually talk about it and go, wow, that's really my trigger, like this is the full way to practice with all this. And then to see him do it I'll see if I can find that video and throw it somewhere around, maybe in the show notes, or, if not, just go look up Colin Noir in the Blackbeard system because he does a really cool YouTube video on it. And so that, to me, was that kind of that selling point of like, okay, this is cool.

Speaker 1: 34:06

Oh, now it's verified by some people I actually follow, you know, and so you know. No offense to you guys, but I know that you, like you said, you eat your own dog food, so you make sure you're definitely going to tout your own stuff right. So it's like, hey, if you're saying this and it's marrying up with everybody, yep, I'm in, I'm solo, and I will say, speaking of the data checking out, by the way, I did have to have these ready for you. So after you're on the app for a while, you get not only you got your basic, I got the advanced here. See if I can do that, there you go, I got my, got my elite marksman. Yeah, got the elite there. And then, so far, I have got the, the basic combat one, and then the advanced combat I got it and I got one more.

Speaker 1: 34:58

Oh, my goodness, dude, and I love the fact that this is just part of what you guys do. I didn't have to pay for those, those are super cool. So they have the back and everything and what I'm like literally on the last test, the last thing for the elite combat and that is the, the hostage rescue advanced. I'm wondering if my system is, because I'm not, I don't have the hard. I know you guys have like the plate to the replacement plate here, for that has the rail on it and I just have it on there with double stick tape right now. So I'm kind of wondering if maybe there's just a tiny bit too much vibration in that.

Speaker 2: 35:43

Maybe I think some help is right here.

Speaker 1: 35:49

That's probably the problem.

Speaker 2: 35:50

Yeah, I don't want to say you're ready to be elite. Yeah, because it sounds like you're really, really close. I'm going to tell you right now the rescue drills are so hard, so hard, at least at level right, like you have to be a couple for the other ones. But yeah, getting getting a very last on the last one, that challenges super difficult.

Speaker 1: 36:18

I think five out of seven, I think it is, or something like that that you get so or seven out of score.

Speaker 2: 36:24

Like you got a score over 90 or 95 for the last seven out of 10, something like that. It's off.

Speaker 1: 36:33

Yeah, the last one here, Let me see if I can pull it up here. The elite combat last one I'm doing. So you got to do complete hostage rescue advanced drill and save at least seven out of the 10 hostages.

Speaker 1: 36:48

And then looks like advanced has to be a score of 85 or higher and a time of less than 1.7 seconds, and y'all, that's that's. That's hard, so it's on the positive. Yeah, yeah, I've seen some folks in the groups doing it and they're showing their elite, their elite badge, so that's good. So I know it's possible. I just got to get better. It's hard it is. They tell me that it was actually the double stick tape or something on there that I'm actually like a nice level.

Speaker 2: 37:23

Maybe you should go out and do it live fire. Just put your sticky note out there at the range and do it. You need to simulate actually rescuing a message and then the adrenaline kicks in and it's going through.

Speaker 1: 37:34

Well, and that's a really cool thing too, because you can use for live fire, so yeah, and I fire. This thing is humbling AF dude.

Speaker 2: 37:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, like I said, you know, I got started early and I was like shot. And then I was like, oh, I'm going to get a score. So I was like, okay, let's take it up and ready, ready dude, I get out there and I was like dang it, dang it, dang it.

Speaker 1: 38:02

I got a little bit of a game. Yeah, I'm hitting 97s on dry fire and then suddenly you go to the range and you're like all right, I'm going to hit at least like a 90, 92 and you're like 76. What is this? What we got going on?

Speaker 2: 38:17

I swear I'm broken an 80. I swear yeah.

Speaker 1: 38:23

Yeah, you're turning the guy next to you going I'm there's a. I was nervous there, it's my wrist or something. I was kind of whatever.

Speaker 2: 38:33

Can you look away? I don't like when people start with me while I shoot it. It throws me out.

Speaker 1: 38:37

Yeah, the criminals will look away, that's for sure. So, speaking, of criminals. I gotta say like it's nuts seeing some of the stuff going on today, Right, Like, have you seen? Has Manta seen? I gotta ask this one have you guys seen an increase in sales in the last? Like? Oh, I don't know, Maybe it's the last three years?

Speaker 2: 39:03

Okay. So yeah, I'm going to quantify this day and a four year, right? Because, like, how much of it is just sculling and then what you made is it's like Driven, you know who is. Like they used to say, I'm the most of the best on salesman, right? Like there might be a new champion out there these days, oh for sure.

Speaker 1: 39:26

He's also the largest purchaser of ice cream.

Speaker 2: 39:30

Yeah yeah. If you don't have shares in blue bunny, you gotta get some because it's going through the rave. Yeah yeah, dunging ice cream are probably sellers these days.

Speaker 1: 39:46

But but yeah, I mean like, so really, yeah, have you seen a pretty big boost, I guess. I mean I don't want to like trash any specific folks, but like definitely you see a lot more gun owners now. You see a lot more folks that have a real concern. I think you know today, and so are you seeing stuff like, are you hearing reports of folks like hey, I really need to take my shooting more seriously and here's why you know, directly related to kind of what's going on in the world.

Speaker 2: 40:18

Yeah, so you know, I think G away has talked about this before, and so is the PC, but Really there are more gun buyers in the last five years and there ever have been in history. Right, I'm not with the rise of the industry at all. Obviously we have our share of that portion of the industry. But the reality is is dry fire in general is being talked about more, and I think just those two points together and how well they're converging is showing on our spectrum quite a bit. And really, you know, it's one of those deals where it's helping us achieve the company mission.

Speaker 2: 41:07

But even more importantly, the fact that dry fire is being talked about so much and there are more gun owners now than ever before, I think we're both not just positive stromantis in the industry but for America, right, that's the point here is it's in our blood. It's the second thing we wrote, right, so it is, it is it's you want to talk about identity and politics and however you want to do that, that's that's as identical as you can get for for the. You know the Republic that we live in. So it's definitely one of those deals where it's for us but it's for the country for sure.

Speaker 1: 41:52

Well, and I like that, like you're saying, I think a lot of people are. You know, even to go back onto a whole different topic. But you know, I, during that big thing where the whole world is set down for like a year or so there, right, I think that was also really good. I was actually obviously not the pandemic itself wasn't good, but I think it did produce some really good results.

Speaker 1: 42:18

Specifically, you know, I've mentioned on here too, but like another episode, but you know you saw folks that kind of started realizing, oh, it depends on me to take care of myself and my family, not that our, you know, police and law enforcement folks are not capable, but they're not omnipresent, right. So I think you know, especially in today's world, no one what's going on and everything. It's like, hey, I need to be prepared, I need to at least have a basic understanding. You know, I think even if a person were to get into like the 70s or 80s on their score, that's better than a 40 or a not shooting at all, and so it's really cool to see that, and so I can only imagine you guys have some, probably some fun conversations around the water cooler there.

Speaker 2: 43:11

So there's a handful, especially when we're doing shows and we've always demo units that shows for people to come up and right and get their hands on it to see how it works. And it's funny watching some people eat a little crow, they walk up the big chest and they're talking about how I shoot my whole life and then you know, shoot a 50, and they're like, well, it's just like I think it's being miscalibrated or something.

Speaker 2: 43:40

No, but it is important, right? It's just like you said. It's like even even people like us, who've been, who've been in it for a long time and doing their own thing and seeing Much improvement, is still in front of us. It's not dumping, you know. It's delivered in a way that makes you hungry for more knowledge and to keep trying. And, you know, if you push that out against all the people that come up to the shows and try it out and there are some funny stories out there, right yeah.

Speaker 1: 44:10

What's all the part of crazy you've seen at a show, like, tell me about a time that, like, was there anything that stood out to you at shot? That's just like, is this real life right now? Like what, so you're out there.

Speaker 2: 44:24

Yeah, I think so. One one good one this was actually one enforcement show last year is like one of my favorite ones is you kind of live in your own like perceptions, reality, like you've heard the word right. So your own bubble is the world you live in and sometimes you get shocked out of that. And so I'm going to this law enforcement show after being here for a year and I'm an OK shooter, but I'm going to law enforcement show. It's my first one.

Speaker 2: 44:53

These guys are all going to be, you know, snapshot wizards and I have to be really careful with what we're doing and which these guys and it was it was actually military police and law enforcement was the show, and a lot of the military police, which you know I'm an army guy and like I go back with those dudes All right, so I would have some expectations going in. I'm at my booth doing my thing and all these guys that had just graduated school came through and they're looking spent you know what I mean Like it follows on hair. They're all carrying their badges and guns. I'm like here we go, this is this is the moment I've been waiting for, right, like these guys are going to just come in here and start looking at any five steps and all four of them shot like 60s and I was like dude.

Speaker 2: 45:43

I was like it's really you know, it's like oh man, like this is, this is military and I'm like no way. I was shocked and they were super cool dudes, like obviously they like they're good dudes and it was. It was a good they was having those like a certain perception of like guardian heroes shots and stuff and like no wonder, it's like dude, you have to check this out. Man, like definitely try it, because I think you would like it and get some, get some work out. But it was really shocking for me. It was, it was one of those days, you know, just like whoa, whoa. So they're super funny, they're really shocking.

Speaker 1: 46:31

Yeah Well, and like you know, you bring up a good point. I think a lot of the times we think those you know anyone in law enforcement we kind of hold them to this almost unrealistic expectation of perfection.

Speaker 1: 46:43

Yes, and then you start seeing stuff. Like you know the situation that happened down in Houston recently and and you see, you see different situations around the country and the world where you think you have a plan, kind of like Tyson says everybody's got a plan until you get punched in the mouth, right yeah. But like suddenly, if you're put in a live fire situation where your or somebody else's life depends on it, you react totally differently. It's hard to train under those exact circumstances and so it's very interesting to see. But like I think it also not only is it funny to kind of go, yeah, they're just normal, they're just like me, but also it is kind of a humbling thing to go, okay, well, if they can do it, so can I. Right, I think I'm going to flip that on his head and say the average person can be just as good as them, and so that's a really cool. That's a really cool story actually. So I like that.

Speaker 2: 47:41

It was. It was definitely one of those deals where you know it and you got to take into consideration to like almost all police departments and you know, including the military to do not get enough time on the range, and that's not their fault. Right, like these are men and women out here putting their lives on the line who were, they are highly trained. Right, they spend a ton of time making this stuff happen. And it is one of those deals where it's like they don't get near enough time out there to go shoot. They don't get enough time to practice and doing something like dry fire alone, with or without Mantis I mean with Mantis, but without to.

Speaker 2: 48:19

It's one of those deals where it's like, okay, this is going to help us push our skills and because that's becoming more popular, it helps in that. But yeah, just like you said, we are heroes and we always have been, and the main way that I go up there and put their lives on the line to help protect those rights and those liberties and these are all of the credit they get, because it's just like you said, the drillman starts pumping things If you don't have the flame water skills that you've drilled into your head over and over, because you don't do it every single day. Something might happen, and it's. It is one of those deals where it's like, yep, this is on me, so take the responsibility and go from. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 49:05

Absolutely, and you know it's funny because I'm actually looking up a video right here, because there's actually one. Where did you see the video from? You know who Agilite is the yeah, plate carrier guys and so, yeah, a lot of really good gear and everything. So they actually did a video, published it right during a short show of from was it from the Middle East, from war to shot show basically is what it was. And so literally one of their guys was in combat and literally flew back Like he was on schedule and everything literally left combat, flies home, showers, changes, has like a night and then gets to shot show and he's just back to back to back and he hits the ground running with this smile on his face. I'm going like that's, that's dedication, right there, that's commitment. And so you know you talking about the, the men and women of our law enforcement and military and everything, just they are their top watch.

Speaker 1: 50:14

You know, obviously there are some crap heads out there that go out, you know, I don't know, light themselves on fire in front of a gate and everything else. But those are some whack jobs, right, those, those are the outliers. And I feel really bad for that guy. I really do, because he's he's bought into something that isn't true, isn't real and Obviously has some different disorders. But at that, at that stage, you know, I think anybody who's experienced some traumatic events would, would kind of have a similar, maybe not quite as rash of a decision. But you know, to speak about our kind of our blanket military and stuff, I mean, do we have some credible folks out there? And so you'll always have the weird bad apples here and there. But Organs, whatever, you know. Yeah, yeah, right.

Speaker 2: 51:07

Yeah, I mean that's the open, the open scale of humanity For us in your media and direct connect and where we can see everything almost immediately. Right it's. It's on the same sort of like. Two separate what it was from, but they're basically saying, like Some famous scientist guy I'm gonna jack this up, some remember who it was, but you know he's basically saying like we weren't like designed or not yet adapted to Yep, taking this information all the time, right, like I'm gonna be tuned in all the time. So you know I like to sometimes Shut it off and go shoot my guns and that's literally therapy for me is for your time. So you know, if life's feeling crazy you can't seem to tune it out, go do some dry presses or, you know, go out to the range and poke some holes in paper and see what that does for your mindset. That seems to help quite a bit.

Speaker 1: 52:10

Yeah, yeah, as long as you're improving your shot, because if you're like me, you go out to the range some days and you end up in a worst mindset why, I got some fun stuff coming up here as well. I think you'll have to. Maybe we'll have to use the Mantis X on the, the thing I was talking to you about before the show, but I don't want to give it away too much because I got yeah, I got a cool comparison video coming up here pretty soon.

Speaker 2: 52:36

But Do you know what's really cool idea? Show the breakdown and data and stuff. That's. That'd be sick. I'm making the ice cream for that one.

Speaker 1: 52:45

Let's do it, man, let's do it. So yeah, so tell me a little bit about. I know we're kind of near in the end of our time here, but where is? Is there anything that you can share where Mantis X is like kind of headed to, because I know like there was just a massive update right to the app and then I think there's some more stuff. There was some hints, I think, what I don't know if it's social channels or what, but there was some hints at big stuff coming. Is there anything you can tell us that maybe is Fair enough to share?

Speaker 2: 53:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely there's. There's a lot of exciting stuff happening and it happening right now. Even so, we did we just dropped laser Academy 2.0. That was, I think, just November and December, so it's only been a couple months. That's been really bad and that's the only other product that we've yet, but Yep, so that just went up and then this year we have a model of it. Sure, show over all the prototypes and three productions that we've got, currently for AR 15. We've just released one for MCX, so those are out. Ar 10, at-47, scar light and scar heavy Circumstance here. Nice, yeah, that's got people electric. They're really excited. We're all the work really excited. And then also at SOC. So I don't know if you get to go into the the dark room there, but we have a projection system coming out that works out of like the bone of what laser Academy is All right it's all.

Speaker 2: 54:21

Yeah, it's. It's really, really cool that the big thing about projection system is we're gonna be competitive for the consumer market, right, like if you don't look at some of those other ones out there who I also won't name names here. But yeah, they're expensive. They're expensive to get into. You know we're talking like thousands of dollars to make that happen. What we've got going on Runs off of your phone into just about any projector. You could get your hands on cheap or expensive Projects, a program for you. It gets recognized by the camera on your phone, just like laser Academy does, and it runs simulations, deal-mophize things. You can use our black beards on them. If our laser pistols so Is gonna be coming out at the same time to you, yeah, we're really excited about that one. That one's gonna be a lot of fun For sure.

Speaker 1: 55:16

Now we? That brings up another question for me, but I have to ask that one off here. So, because I got ideas, oh, I got ideas. So, man, dude, that's awesome, because I think you know that's If I gotta say man, obviously you guys have already done the work and the research and everything. But I'm going yeah, that's the perfect next step. Right, is that projection side? And going like, how do you take my fight to the next level? They're dad's insane.

Speaker 2: 55:43

And that also reminds me to and I probably should have started with this instead of the projection thing. We've just been doing for a while and are ready to drop it. But we are doing. We're doing some work with a company called Magic Leap who uses in various augmented reality goggles Okay, and we have a little display for that shot shows well, but basically there are goggles that are running, you know, targets or simulations or things for you place in the real world.

Speaker 2: 56:10

So not just a VR simulation that you can use your blackbeard for. And, as a matter of fact, if anyone wants to go see any of and if you guys see any active self-protection, any of those guys like John Korea or Neil Whiteman they did a video of that so if you want to go see it, go look at the ass slash mantis X augmented reality. Go check it on YouTube. You can see how it works and it's gonna be really exciting to you. Don't stones a little bit further out in the projection system, but obviously it's up and running and off the ground and we're making work on it, so that's a really cool system to you.

Speaker 1: 56:45

Well, I'm glad you said that I'll actually throw a link to that down in the description of this, of this episode. So then that way folks will pick it out they can, because, yeah, I am really excited to hear about that one, to see it.

Speaker 2: 56:56

So yeah, it's gonna be pretty cool. We're really excited about that one. Just, you know, it's one of those deals where it's your rainfall and you know, and also would be your world with targets in it, so it's gonna be pretty sweet.

Speaker 1: 57:12

We're excited, absolutely now that's, that's amazing. Well, I mean, I can say I know, I know Kara was out there with you guys during shot and GOS, and she goes right, I can't even tell you what's coming, and I'm like I'm sure that's probably what it was, but it was just like I can't even tell you what's coming, but you're, you're gonna flip when you see what's happening. I'm like, okay, cool, you know. Like what do you?

Speaker 2: 57:35

what do you mean? I didn't know what she's talking and you are gonna flip and you really, I can't say much, I can't say anything, but I got you. Well, now it comes out, it's gonna be like dude, what it's? It's gonna be nuts.

Speaker 1: 57:48

Um, well, now I know that you're. You're coming my way here before too long for some personal stuff, right yeah? Yeah, I'm gonna be done it like three weeks ago. So so you're gonna slip that into your bag, whatever that is, and then I will I've just seen it.

Speaker 2: 58:07

But before they go out to the palm, obviously we're gonna, if things dice ever roll the right way, yeah, let's go, man, let's go.

Speaker 1: 58:19

Yeah, I'm, I'm pretty cool. I'm excited to see everything that you guys have going on and and kind of what's coming out this year. So Again, man, um, I get so. Thanks so much for being on the show. Uh, I really appreciate you taking time. I know, like I say, it's been a couple weeks for us kind of coming here, but, um, I'm glad we finally had the chance to sit down and chat.

Speaker 2: 58:39

Thanks to you, man. I really appreciate being here and you know, obviously I love talking about what we do and and I love mantis, but, um, you know, being able to sit down with cool people and have good conversations about it and what's going on with the industry, I can't tell you how much I personally appreciate that and how much mantis appreciates the opportunity to do so. Thank you.

Speaker 1: 58:57

Hey, of course, man, anytime I uh, like I say, I've got some stuff coming out this year that, uh, I'm gonna try to partner up with you guys some more Um, to show not only you know it's not salesy, but at the same point just to kind of show that it really does help me, um, and so I'm really excited for that. But, um, and I'm also going to be very, very happy once I finally get my elite combat badge. So that thing pisses me off so bad right now.

Speaker 1: 59:26

Just breathe through it Yep, ah, well, cool. Um, thanks again for checking out the episode here. I appreciate you guys, uh, everybody who's tuned in. If you want to learn more about mantis, uh, go check out the section, the description of this show here. Uh, I'll actually put links to anything we talked about in the description here.

Speaker 1: 59:46

Um, and also, you know, like I say, if you want to get the x, the x 10, I would, I would definitely recommend the x 10. You can still get the x, yep, two, three. I think you get two or three right now. I'll get the 10 for sure. We just send a little extra. It's not much. But you get holster draw analysis and everything else. So I'll throw a link to that down there as well. Um, because, like you say, it's it's crazy, but I am. I have fully drank the kool-aid at this point. It's 94 shooters, myself included, can can say in less like 20 minutes dude, you're shot improves, that's nuts. So, um, also, again, a big shout out to our sponsor, alien gear holsters. Uh, be sure, and check out their new rapid force level 3 duty holsters in the show notes also. And, uh, I guess we will see you on the next episode here on the brew house. Thanks again, jack.

Speaker 2: 1:00:39

Thanks guys.