Trailblazing the Craft Beer Industry with Master Brewer Bradley Riggs

Speaker 1: 0:00

Hey everyone, what's going on? It's TheBeardBro, and welcome to episode two of the Brew House Joining me today. I actually sat down with Bradley Riggs of Hawk Moth Brewing and Bike Rack Brewing most recently. I'll let him tell his story in this, but it's a pretty cool story how he got started at a brewery here in Rogers and then eventually launched his own a very, very short time later. So without further ado, here is episode two of the Brew House featuring Bradley Riggs.

Speaker 2: 0:51

We're pouring up the best in beer, podcasting straight from the mouths of today's top brewers to your thirsty ears. Get ready to hear how they're pouring their heart and soul into making the best pint possible. This is the Brew House.

Speaker 1: 1:07

Well, yeah, so welcome back, man. Thanks for having me Excited to have you here on the Brew House, and you know, I tell you what. We've known each other for a while now. But yeah, I mean the folks listening, don't. So we'll just delve into a little bit about who Bradley is here, man.

Speaker 3: 1:24

Okay, so let's see, my name is Bradley Riggs. I have lived in Benton County, arkansas, my entire life. I am a local through and through. So as far as my beer journey goes, I worked in the distributor world for a few years bartending before that and then went to go work for New Province in Rogers, ran their sales team for about a year and a half, did some experimental pilot batches homebrew in the whole time while I was doing that kind of a diving into the weird unexplored beers of our market.

Speaker 3: 1:59

In a previous life I traveled a lot and fell in love with craft beer and all these small towns. So I said, wow, why is why is no one brewing these cool you know French table beers and all this stuff in Northwest Arkansas? And I kind of had a passion for off the wall beer. So I opened Hawk Moth about three and a half years ago in downtown Rogers very small batch barrel focused brewery and then kept evolving in this beer industry journey ended up forming a legal merger with Biker Act brewing here in Bentonville, which is where we're at today. That went legal by documentation on January one of 2021. What year we in what year was last year, 22, january one of 21. So for the last little under 18 months I've been running operations of both places and have a fancy title of CEO now, so it's pretty impressive, right so you guys are all caught up traveling sales guy to that.

Speaker 1: 3:00

So, so okay, All right, let that's the podcast guys. That's it.

Speaker 3: 3:04

Game over. That's all I got. Actually, I got it all out of the way for the opening spill and I'll be silent for the next 45 minutes two and a half minutes in.

Speaker 1: 3:11

We're good, covered it, no, so so let's go back really quick. So you were talking about you started out as at New Province. What led you there? I mean, was it just the sales job or kind of what?

Speaker 3: 3:23

Okay, so we got Jim there's always a story to that every chapter. I was actually working at Arkansas craft craft focus beer distributor in North of Arkansas for the year and a half before that New Province had almost been open for a year and decided they wanted to start distributing. I knew Derek, the owner, pretty well and I knew court Castleberry their head had brewer really well and ultimately court is what I was drawn to. He was the magnet in the business of. I want to go work with this guy. I think he's brewing really great stuff. He has a true passion for simply making good beer.

Speaker 1: 4:03

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 4:04

And I wanted to be a part of that in Rogers. It's six minutes from my house, and so I applied for that sales job, got it and ran with it. We grew as a company from man probably from 400 barrels to 1400 barrels in a calendar year, and I'm sorry, said those numbers again, I think we like.

Speaker 3: 4:29

I mean I showed up at like 11 months into the business being open to. They were very young and maybe my numbers are wrong. Derek recorded they listen to this. Please correct me but I think in the first year they were on pace like 400 or 500 barrels and most of that was in house sales. They weren't really distributing anything very, very little and by the end of year two we were over a thousand barrels, I think, over 1400 barrels with, I'm going to say, 60, 70% of that was in distro in the market. So, yeah, we had over 100 accounts between Benton and Washington County and it was really satisfying, but it was a lot of physical labor. I was the one selling the keg and then slinging the keg. Okay, I don't know, I guess I'm a glutton for punishment because I said, cool, I don't like this aspect, so I'm going to open my own brewery so I can do all of the aspects.

Speaker 1: 5:23

Yeah, yeah, yeah, they. They say you know, you'll work 4050 hours a week and then you become an entrepreneur and you just won't stop working.

Speaker 3: 5:33

Yeah, you, you, you quit counting the time, yeah.

Speaker 1: 5:35

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 5:36

Yeah, time is just a sun up and sun down, so what can I accomplish when the sun's up and what can I continue to accomplish when the sun is down? Exactly that's how the days work, yeah, but I think I want to have a. I had a fear of boredom, possibly in opening Hawk Moth and then running that for a year and a half. Covid shows up. Everyone's kind of sitting around saying what do we do? I hadn't had any downtime in years. Mentally I hadn't had any downtime. And so the merger talks started and I think I was just bored enough to say, yeah, let's take on another brewery. Yeah, right, and I love the ownership team of bycrack. So they brought me in to be an owner operator and so, cool, fear of boredom gone.

Speaker 1: 6:21

Yeah, crushed it. Yeah, no worries. Are there? No worries? So so what was it? How was it received? I know, whenever you know, if you're working at a brewery and you go up to your boss and be like hey, dude, I love your beer, but here's the deal, I'm going to make my own Deuces. Yeah, how do you? How? How was that received?

Speaker 3: 6:42

Okay. So with the new province again, I went to go work for an owner that I knew and I liked. That helped a lot. And and even whenever I interviewed for the sales job I mentioned, you know I would like to open my own brewery at some point. I didn't put a timeline on it. I didn't know a timeline Once I started it's. It is funny how timing works. It's almost like like dating as soon as you stop looking to date, you find a girl that you got to start dating right then and there yeah, and I married her in an eight thousand Right you know that's.

Speaker 3: 7:17

there's something to that, that energy in the universe that we're drawn to. So three weeks after I started my job, I met who ended up becoming my two investors of Hockmoth. Three weeks after that I had no timeline and it went from getting hired to three months in working on a business plan, saying yeah, probably in the next year, wow.

Speaker 1: 7:40

So so what you're saying is you're not a procrastinator.

Speaker 3: 7:43

No, I'm, I'm overly eager. Again back to the whole fear of boredom. I just I can't allow any boredom to ever set in.

Speaker 1: 7:50

Maybe there's some 80D in that, actually, but I feel like I identify very well with that. Yeah, that's, yeah, that's great.

Speaker 3: 7:57

So it had been almost a year once the business plan got serious enough you know, I was trying to go get loans from banks and things and sat down with Derek and said, hey, so I had mentioned that I wanted to open a brewery. Well, that timeline is, in my mind, at least a year ahead of schedule. I think it's going to be this year that we're going to open a brewery, but I'm probably going to do it in Bentonville. So you know, you guys in Ozark can continue to dominate downtown Rogers and I'll continue to be a big fan of your brand. I'll do my job All good, because it's the same account buyers. You've got to stay close friends with everyone.

Speaker 3: 8:39

Yeah, it is a small community here, and so from January to March only about 60 days I went from I'm going to open this in Bentonville to hey, derek. I signed a lease in downtown Rogers. It's like four minutes down the road and he's like man, all good, like we have our place, you're going to earn your place and there's plenty more room for craft beer in the market. I loved that mentality, because that was, that was how I felt about it and it was nice to hear him say that. And we have continued to be very close friends. You know, through me leaving, I brought in my replacement and trained him and and was still in their back of house every week before the brewery was open just hanging out with court, pasting stuff, trying stuff. We stayed close over that. That summer as I was opening Hockmoth- yeah, was there any?

Speaker 1: 9:33

as you guys were brewing there at New Province, was there any like, was there a specific beer that just jumped out that you were like, hey, that was the catalyst for like I could be crazier with this beer or I could do something. This is a great base, but how do I grow it?

Speaker 3: 9:52

Not necessarily inspiring to like my style, but the first beer that I was like court, you're a genius, no one's doing anything like this was his like orange cream ale, okay, and that one he was able to show me that like just peeling oranges, just getting the oils from the skin, was enough to translate in whatever volume of beer you needed and I had never thought about how strong citrus zest is in beer. I think we were. We were doing like 30 barrels with 30 oranges. It wasn't very much and it was translating. And again, of course, listening.

Speaker 3: 10:31

My ratios may be off, but I remember being blown away Don't worry about you how everybody else how few oranges we were using and how strong of the orange flavor we were getting. The citrus oils were awesome. So so you use real oranges there. Yeah, it would have been their second anniversary, or no? Was it the first anniversary? Yeah, we did a saison on orange pills. Yeah, so I had been there just for a month or two and was blown away by how much orange flavor we got in the beer just from sitting around with sanitized gloves peeling oranges. Yeah, absolutely. And so that kind of opened my eyes to sometimes the best things are the simplest things. Sometimes less is more.

Speaker 1: 11:16

Yeah, absolutely. So you went on, you left New Province, you moved over to your own brewery then. So Hawk Moth, yeah, and you mentioned it was right at the beginning of the pandemic. Really, I mean so yeah, how'd that go?

Speaker 3: 11:31

It certainly wasn't in the projections or the business plan we opened in September of 2018. Then the pandemic hits in March of 2020. And by the time we got to our third anniversaries September of 21, it was the week of and someone said hey, you and I, rebill, who opened the same week that we did in Seattle Springs you guys have been open longer post pandemic than pre pandemic. And I was like what the heck? I don't view life like that. It was a strange realization of, oh yeah, our entire business survival. We've done COVID longer than pre COVID, but it almost gave you the sense of what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, absolutely so powering through 2020. Powering through 2021, going into 2022, which is where we're at now. I think we feel stronger than ever from both brands Hockmoth and Bicorrect standpoint. That's cool.

Speaker 1: 12:41

Do you remember what was the first beer you brewed over at Hockmoth?

Speaker 3: 12:44

Yes, I do know, because it's a story Back to my whole. Strange beers is my interest. The first homebrew beer I ever made I mean at all the first whole like all grain homebrew beer, was a bearded guard. That's not normal, but I thought it gave fermentation the best chance to not worry so much about the exact temp.

Speaker 1: 13:13

Yeah, explain to listeners what's a bearded guard, in case they're not familiar.

Speaker 3: 13:17

Bearded guard by what my take was on. It was an amber focused saison, so think a French style amber with a decent hop presence. You want 20 to 30 IBUs to kind of give it more of that preservative stable base. But the alcohol isn't crazy, probably between six and seven. So not really a table beer but certainly not an imperial beer. Just it was appropriately named somewhere in between as it is a catch all style of beers. So I just knew that I wanted the fermentation temp to be able to get a little wild, as it I didn't have, you know, conicles or anything in my so you would have some fluctuation, for sure.

Speaker 2: 14:02

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 14:03

So I wanted to start with that. So then you know, speed up. Four years, I'm getting to brewing my first beer at Hockmoth. I had to brew a bearded guard. I had to complete that full circle journey of brew something that you're so confident in brewing as you break in the system and learn about the system, because every system I ever brewed on is different. That's just how it goes. But brew something that is somewhere in between all of these other styles. So I brewed that beer for a couple of years. I currently don't brew anymore, but it ran its course and had its time to shine.

Speaker 1: 14:40

Absolutely. So now, if I'm correct in my timing there, have you just been like at that point, had you just been home brewing for four years, or were you home brewing a little bit before?

Speaker 3: 14:51

you brewed a bearded guard.

Speaker 3: 14:53

As far as home brewing before that it would have been with other people. Yeah, yeah, as far as solo home brewing, about four years in the two years leading up to signing the dotted line on my loans for Hockmoth, I did about 200 home brews. So I was doing about one a week for two straight years. It was a lot of data. You know I was doing it just for the research purposes. A lot of times I would brew a beer and once you get in that rotation you're having a new keg every week. So I was inviting people over to my house every weekend just to be able to crush the keg. So I had the keg to fill back up for the next beer the following week.

Speaker 1: 15:34

It was a lot of really good trial and error. Suddenly, I'm sad that I didn't know you then. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 15:40

Yeah, that was backyard patio hangs were a lot of fun.

Speaker 1: 15:44

The beer wasn't the only thing hazy, right? So it's true. That's really fascinating, because I think when I think of brewers that start their own business, you know it's all over the map. Really. I mean, from any of the stories that I've heard from folks, maybe some people have been brewing for the better part of a decade and they wouldn't even think of opening a brewery. But then some people they do their first home brew and then they're like, okay, how can I do this for six more months and then jump right in and so I think four years. I think that's pretty good, a pretty solid base.

Speaker 3: 16:16

Yeah, and the thing is, in the last four years of professional brewing I've learned so much, and four years from now I'm going to know so much more. I mean, that's a huge chunk of time to absorb knowledge. So, absolutely, I would say yeah, if you can brew for four, eight, 12 years before you do it pro, that's going to be even better. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 16:39

Well, it's going to make you guessing less and more confident with every move that you make At the end of the day, you can read a whole bunch of stuff online about whatever you're doing, but until you actually do it, you don't 100% know how it reacts to whatever combination you're using. But I want to open a brewery before I was 30. So that was the goal. Mission accomplished, right. Mission accomplished, signed my loans at 29 and a half, yeah.

Speaker 1: 17:08

So now, how are things looking for Hockmoth right now? I mean, you guys trending upward, I would assume. Thank you for assuming that.

Speaker 1: 17:16

I do because I've had your beer and it's delicious. So I'm always surprised and always intrigued by the flavors you put out, because it's never something I'm expecting. Yeah, and also your naming is fantastic as well. So you know, well done on that. But yeah, I would just think, like I would assume it's trending upward for you. Are you staying there in downtown Rogers? Are you kind of like, oh yeah, I guess Expanding Plenty of good info for you? So the funny part is we didn't talk about this ahead of time, so I just sprung that on you.

Speaker 3: 17:48

We did not. But I'll let you know some secrets. Oh, I like secrets. So as I was brewing bearded guards four years ago, when I first opened, I was adamantly saying I'm not going to brew a pale ale, not because I don't like pale ales. I personally drink a lot of pale ales. My whole thing was, as Derek kind of showed me love whenever I left New Province of hey man, it's fine Like this market can handle more good craft beer. I kind of took that of hey guys. There's a brewery five blocks away called Ozark who brews a really good pale ale and I don't want to brew a pale ale, just to say I also brew a pale ale like Ozark. I want Ozark to continue to brew that pale ale and pale ale drinkers buy that beer and drink that beer. I'm going to keep buying and drinking that beer.

Speaker 3: 18:40

Fast forward two years. I hire a new assistant brewer and start getting him trained on the creative side and he wants to brew a pale ale and I was like man Hockmoth's really been set on never brewing a pale ale. So we gave in to do a pale ale. And you're commenting on you like our names. We appropriately decided to name it. Change of plans, as hey, sometimes in life there's just a change of plan. So pale ale just came out a few weeks ago and it's called change of plans, very appropriate. Took me over three years but I did end up making a juicy pale ale in the end.

Speaker 3: 19:21

Expansion Production-wise I'm really happy with having my hands on the product as detailed as I do. We only make about three maybe max ceiling 400 barrels of beer a year with the Hockmoth brand. But we are opening a new beer bar, a Hockmoth-themed beer bar, in downtown Bittenville. Really, yeah, fantastic. It's going to be called the Beacon and it's kind of riffing off of the fact that moths are drawn to light. So we'll have the production facility in downtown Rogers and then we'll have a whole separate themed beer bar in downtown Bittenville. That's very light-oriented and we kind of wanted to sum up where I'm at in my production creative journey with Biker as well. So you could imagine the moth being drawn to the light or you could imagine like an old school headlight on a bicycle, like whenever you pedal it lights up. And we wanted to get both of those creative vibes and smash them into one. So the beacon is coming very soon, probably late spring.

Speaker 1: 20:33

So now, that's exciting, because I had no idea about that one and I think that we've actually got. I think that's going to play very nicely into a total spoiler alert. There's actually an announcement coming on next week's episode that I may have already recorded, okay, but yeah, you guys are going to want to stick around for that one too, because Bentonville is shifting and growing and I think that's going to play very nicely to what's getting ready to be announced next week. So, really quick, let's talk Hawk Moth. I know the story, but tell everybody about where. Does what made you name a brewery Hawk Moth brewery? Because I don't think about super strange beer, you know.

Speaker 3: 21:20

Yeah. So my wife and I took our honeymoon to Portland Maine and if you've never been, it is a beer mecca. It is a utopia of vibes and quality beer and quality food. And so we went there right as we started working on our business plan. So our creative vibes were at an all time high. We were really trying to crank out things and we did not have a brand established. At that point I knew that I didn't want it to be the name of the area, the town or my last name, and that works for a lot of brews. I'm not saying that's a negative thing, but I wanted something really off the wall to kind of match the creative side of the liquid of the beer. So she, out of nowhere throughout, like hey, what if we called it Hawk Moth? And I was like that's super strange, I don't like that.

Speaker 1: 22:13

What are you hipster?

Speaker 3: 22:15

And I don't know, like two weeks past probably, and we we just got home and I went to work and came home and I was like why can I not stop thinking about the name Hawk Moth? Okay, and she said I just wanted to tell me where you came up with that. I didn't give you a chance to explain it, I just like cut it off.

Speaker 3: 22:34

I thought it was too weird and she said oh, I was reading about these mods, these giant mods. They're native to Central and South America and kind of over time they have been slowly migrating North, and they don't really migrate any farther North than the Ozarks. So in the Southern climate they'll get up to like nine inches in wingspan. We're talking straight up birds at that point. But in this climate they'll get to four inches pretty easily, which is still a huge, freaking moth. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 23:07

Especially when you're concerned like your, your only thing to contrast that with is like little ones that you see. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3: 23:12

Whenever you see a four inch moth, it stands out to you. It's also kind of one of those things it's been like whenever you buy a new car, you suddenly see that new car everywhere. Yeah, I don't know what that is called, but I've started noticing mods all the time over the last three years and people will send me pictures all the time Like is this a Hawk moth in my back patio? So they are heavily in the Ozarks. Okay, just open your eyes.

Speaker 1: 23:38

If you had a random percentage to throw out right now, how accurate are people in identifying that's a Hawk?

Speaker 3: 23:43

moth. The most common misconception are Luna moths. Luna moths are pretty popular and are not Hawk moths.

Speaker 1: 23:51

Okay.

Speaker 3: 23:52

But, with that being said, hawk moths have like 2000 different types of species. It's rare that, unless you're seeing the same one, you'll never see the same species again.

Speaker 1: 24:01

Really.

Speaker 3: 24:03

And so I loved that. Let's brew all these one off beers and once they're gone, they're gone. I loved that correlation. But what I really loved was kind of creating a story from the interesting details of their story of how many people do you know that have moved to Northwest Arkansas in the last decade? They get here, they stay here and they love the quality of life, so they're never leaving and this area just keeps growing, fast growing area in the nation. And I loved that core correlation of we all think that we're just going to keep traveling somewhere until we get home and when we're home, we're home and when you know it, you know it. So I said, okay, hawk moth is so weird, I think it works Like it's. It's so strange. You get stuck in your head and once you experience the beer and the branding and that whole culture, it's with you, it's it's. It's not going to be easily forgotten. So we wanted a brand that was as creative as the beer itself. Yeah, and I think Hawk moth is that.

Speaker 1: 25:12

I think it absolutely nails it and I love the way you kind of correlated that between not only the beers that you, that you have in release and they are here and gone. So, like there's some beers you will never see again at Hawk moth, there's some that you try to imitate or recreate over a different kind. But and I think that does relate very well to what we have here in Northwest Arkansas going on, because I mean the last I heard it was like 55 people a day moving to Northwest Arkansas and I know the numbers are higher than that now.

Speaker 3: 25:43

Yeah, I think we're on a 10 year trend that Bentonville's population not NWA's population, but Bentonville's population is going to be half a million people.

Speaker 1: 25:52

It's going to be insane around here.

Speaker 3: 25:53

And for reference, right now we're at like 60. So we're talking 10 times growth in 10 years. No other markets are doing that it's it is fun to be a part of and kind of watch it as a as a true local. I've been here when it was all fields and there's a whole lot less fields now.

Speaker 1: 26:08

If you can say that line, you were officially old, just so you know.

Speaker 3: 26:12

Ah man, I have a. I guess I never felt old until I hit 30 and 30. I don't feel as old, but I was trying to think back whenever I was a little kid. What age did I think was old? If I'm a, if I'm a seven year old, I have a seven year old. And so I just asked her this like, what age do you think is old? Well, I mean, 30 is that is that age? And I forgot about my mindset as a child until I was 30 and was like oh man, I think this is the old age. And obviously I'm saying, no, I'm 30. I don't feel old, I'm just getting going. I don't feel old. Must be 40 actually, but I'm sure I'll say it's 50 whenever I'm 40, but 30 was a big number. 30 is definitely saying your 20s are behind you. Game over Game over Move on.

Speaker 3: 27:01

It's time to grow up.

Speaker 1: 27:03

Very cool, well so. So then you, you've got Hawk Moth going. You're still doing it right now, yes, but somewhere along the way somebody else took notice of you and said hey, we have some great beers brewing here in our own brewery, but how did it come about that you got involved with bike rack brewing, where we're actually recording at bike rack today. So if you hear any, you know thuds or anything like that, they're actually. Is that canning?

Speaker 3: 27:31

right there.

Speaker 1: 27:31

Yeah, so like you hear that I don't know if you're hearing in the background, but I'm going to try to edit most of that out, but authentic sound though. Hey, this is brewery life, man, I'm loving it, and so we're here at bike right now. But but the question is like yeah, how how did that come about that you became a part of this family as well?

Speaker 3: 27:51

Yeah, so um, kind of their operations manager slash CFO, all their financial dealings. I knew that guy super well. I've known him, for he's in Brandon. I've known him for longer than half of my life probably. He's probably my oldest friend and he was going to come work for me at Hawk Moth before we opened and the bike right deal just kept getting bigger and bigger and so he stayed with them and that was all good. I thought he should have, as it was, a better growth opportunity. So speed up three years. They're kind of looking to hone in on the next vision of their brand and the ownership group it was. It was five owners who all have day jobs and sink their extra time into the brewery. They saw that they desperately needed an owner operator, someone who can sit in the board meetings but is also here nine to five throughout the week kind of managing literally what's happening in the back.

Speaker 3: 28:54

Yes, Um, so they, they kind of approached me in in January of 2020, just a few months before the pandemic, and I thought the idea was so crazy that, uh, I had to entertain it like no one's ever done this. No one's ever in. In theory, I guess. On paper it's two competed, two competing breweries in the same market, although we're apples and oranges as to what we're doing, style lies we're we're 12 minutes apart. Um, no one's ever done this, but I'm intrigued by that also if no one's ever done it. So the talks sped up pretty aggressively over the next 45 days or so throughout February, and then the pandemic hit in March and both brands were just like what are we actually going to do over the rest of this calendar year? Um, so the merger became a reality of. This is a very healthy way to survive this. Everyone was scrambling how are small businesses going to survive this?

Speaker 1: 29:59

and and small businesses are always stronger together. I mean, I think that turns out absolutely.

Speaker 3: 30:05

Um, you know, you kind of shed some some ego and say what is best for the business, and both brands felt that kind of joining all of our admin expenses and our resources would save enough money to offset the huge reduction in revenue of the pandemic. So we started operating as independent brands but as one management group. Throughout the rest of 2020, probably about like quarter four we were operating as one management group and then we set up the legal documentation to make it official and a little over a year in and it was definitely the best career choice of my life it has opened a lot of doors and created a lot of big stages that I never thought I would have had. Like Hawk Moth is intended to be a off-the-wall niche brewery, but it still feels really cool to walk into a Walmart and see a six-pack that I brewed. It was never intended to be Hawk Moth and it won't be, but getting to achieve that with Bi-Crack was pretty flattering.

Speaker 1: 31:11

Absolutely. Well, very cool so then. So I got to ask you you're kind of brought in to, like you said, hone in some of the flavors that they have here, some of the beers that are going. Is there one beer? And well, I'm just going to be pointed and ask is there a beer that, like your first beer in the door, you were just like, okay, it's definitely going to be that one.

Speaker 3: 31:33

Um, so I was given 100% creative control whenever I signed the documents. They must trust you, and people yeah don't fully understand that is what that means is all the way down to. If I wanted to change the name of Bi-Crack or something, I think I had the power to do it right, like they really felt that they could give me the keys to the to the palace.

Speaker 1: 31:59

Yeah, if you heard that big thunk just there, I'm not going to explain what that was.

Speaker 3: 32:03

Anyways, go ahead. Um, so it wasn't so much a single product, it was let's look at all of the products and let's, let's change them all, like, let's, let's start to evolve, understanding what the products are and where we want them to be in a year. And uh, so we, we started with taking it from great to excellent.

Speaker 3: 32:28

Yeah, that was the goal of what works. Okay, let's make it work even better. And and slaughter pen IPA is the number one selling beer for this house, and so we we wanted to figure out well, how can we actually use more Citra hops in this beer while spending less on Citra hops, getting them on contract and and make their best selling beer even better? So that was actually the first project. It wasn't taking the worst beer and making it better, it was taking the best beer and making it even better. Yeah, so that at this point, uh, 14 months later, we have over, we've overhauled everything.

Speaker 1: 33:02

Yeah, so, so when you, when you overhauled let's just talk slaughter pen really quick. So how? Um, first of all, if you're not familiar with Northwest Arkansas uh, they name a lot of their, uh, a lot of their beers If you hadn't told about bike rack brewing, um, there, there's an amazing trail system here in Northwest Arkansas, perfect for tourism. Uh, come, come, check out the area, but you know, not only to stop in here at bike rack, but we've got some really awesome trails and it's expanding constantly, uh, every day.

Speaker 3: 33:33

Yeah, I mean I think we have maybe you can comment over a hundred miles of paved trails. Yeah, Um, within this county alone.

Speaker 1: 33:43

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 33:44

So it's think Aspen, think Asheville, north Carolina, it's, it's maybe those trail systems on steroids actually, yeah, it's. It's even better than those major markets are when, when you have the pro riders of those towns flying here every every month to come ride these trails, you know you've done something. And with bike rack brewing, we feel like we are the beer of the mountain bikers of this area. Whether you're traveling in or you live here, we are the beer of that clientele and that's a lot of fun because it's a it's a pretty cool clientele.

Speaker 1: 34:23

Oh, absolutely yeah. I mean, we've had a lot of different traveling groups, events, organizations roll through here, and to think that you guys are primed right here, especially being right off the greenway, uh, I mean, it's a great spot to stop in. So, uh, but thinking about the, the slaughter pin, when you reformulated, when you kind of tweaked it a little bit, did anybody notice? Was there? Were there some like longtime drinkers or like something's different here?

Speaker 3: 34:50

Um, it's. It's strange Hops are kind of a a magical ingredient that you can change the flavor and continue to boost the bitterness in a beer and people can't tell the difference because hops overwhelm your palette to whereas so you're. The short answer to that is slaughter pin and all the changes, probably like probably a three stage set of changes over the first six months or something we're all received really well, um, it was a gradual change. And so six months later with a different beer, but you can't even remember what the old one was at that point. Okay, it's the light stuff that if you add 2% more corn, someone's like this beer tastes different.

Speaker 3: 35:38

And so our golden ale has actually been the most talked about changed beer. It's not our number one seller, but the locals that do drink it have drank it every day for five years. Okay, and they're like something is different in this beer because it is flavor stripped down and you notice all the subtleties about it. So, yeah, it's, uh, it's. It's been fun, trial and error, it's. It's been fun to hear feedback of your literal neighbors on the streets and say they're like oh, you know, I liked this batch of golden. Uh, what was the difference? And explain to him and they're like okay, well, I didn't like these changes in this batch Trends. Transparency is is healthy.

Speaker 1: 36:15

I think that's really cool to see, because I think that a lot of brewers have this idea that people, the general public, doesn't want to get involved with the science of it or kind of the makeup of it, they just want to drink it. But I think it's really cool to see that you guys are involving your, your regulars and kind of that local community to where they can give feedback and it truly does impact your beers, uh, in a very real way.

Speaker 3: 36:38

There are people walking in this taproom every day that simply have been drinking golden more frequently and longer than I have. Yeah, so I want to listen to their opinion. Yeah, that's like there's some some wisdom in their words.

Speaker 1: 36:50

Absolutely so. So, looking at the board, uh, you have one that's simply called beer.

Speaker 2: 36:56

Uh, tell me where that guy comes in.

Speaker 1: 36:58

It was. Was that your brainchild?

Speaker 3: 36:59

Yeah, so that was the first, um, you know, all new products kind of introduced. I always wanted to brew a classic American logger. Yeah, Um, but with the Hawk Moth set up, it's, it's small, it's tight and limited space, and so loggers just don't make sense. Um, it takes a lot longer to brew a logger you tie it up tanks at least twice as long, sometimes three times as as long and just more finicky.

Speaker 1: 37:24

Um, when you say classic American logger, what? What would you contrast your beer?

Speaker 3: 37:31

Cords, banquet, miller, highlife yeah, buddy, it's. Those were the two inspirations of let's understand who drinks this beer. Why do they drink this beer? Why have they drank this beer for 30 years? Hmm, we don't need to reinvent the wheel. We are trying to make Bentonville's version of banquet.

Speaker 3: 37:52

So the story of why I'm so passionate about a 4% logger is I surprise, I wasn't alive in the seventies in golden Colorado, but I want to imagine that if I was and I walked into the random watering hole down the street and peak horse was dropping off the keg, I want this to taste like that pint of authentic banquet. Okay, I mean, banquet now isn't what it was in the seventies, it just it. Just, that's just how it evolves. Yeah, but I want to brew a true classic American logger Bentonville's beer. Yeah, so the the branding is clean and simple as three colors blue, white and gold, a classic ribbon style banner on the can and beer in big letters, and then underneath it it says classic American logger. But if you remember all the cans in the eighties, they all simply just set beer on them. It was to advertise what the product was. It is beer and in the eighties all beer was the same style of beers. You didn't have to specify what the style was. It was beer. So hey, let's just make things simple. Don't over complicate things.

Speaker 1: 39:06

Yeah, I think that's fantastic. I have had the beer and it is. It is wonderful it is a great. Yeah, it's a great lake beer. It's a great river beer. It's it's perfect for the golf course.

Speaker 3: 39:18

It was our first beer that we put in 12 packs and I felt that was pretty appropriate. As this is a 12 pack style of beer, the price points lower on it. It's intended to be cheaper to get in your fridge, it's. It's just a classic American beer.

Speaker 1: 39:31

It's that lawnmower beer for sure. Yes, I love it, love it. Well, let's go to commercial break really quick and then, after we get back, we will talk just a little bit more and well, you'll see, all right, cheers. Hey, y'all, it's the Beard Bros.

Speaker 1: 39:46

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Speaker 2: 40:32

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Speaker 2: 41:04

You're listening to the Brew House, the podcast for beer lovers of all types. Now back to the show.

Speaker 1: 41:16

All right, welcome back to the Brew House. So with me today is Bradley Riggs from Bike Rack and Hawk Moth Brewing here. He started as a brewer. Now he's CEO of Bike Rack, the Brewing Company. That's insane dude, that's super cool.

Speaker 3: 41:30

It's just a title on a business card that I don't even have business cards, so it's just a title actually, if that's the case, it's like scribble it on a can. Right, I need to start scribbling it on napkins for people, yeah.

Speaker 1: 41:40

That could be fun. So we sipped a beer during that first part of the interview. What beer were we drinking there, man?

Speaker 3: 41:46

That was the Viking Kviking Winter Edition, which it's a quarterly rotating Kvike style IPA, and the winter edition was a black IPA variant, which was really neat. I think it's one of the better black IPAs I've ever had. That yeast is fun. You ferment at over 90 degrees and you add a lot of experimental tropical hops and they just explode. So all of that put into a. If you look at the color, it is black like a stout. That's a really cool beer.

Speaker 1: 42:21

Yeah, that was very dark and I was kind of on that thought process of like, ok, how am I going to like this? What's the flavor's going to come out? And it was just super smooth.

Speaker 3: 42:30

It's interesting and fruity, not roasty and heavy, and that's hard to do, so we were pretty proud of that.

Speaker 1: 42:36

That's super cool, super cool. Well, let's talk really quick. So, like, as you've kind of gone through, whether it's been at you know, your time in New Province, whether it's been at Hawk Moth or here at Bike Rack, have you done many like collaborations or anything like that with other brewers? How are you reaching out?

Speaker 3: 42:55

Yeah, so I'm going to decent story of collabs. It started my first one. I went back and did a collaboration with New Province OK, and as Hawk. Moth, yeah, ok, and two Rogers Breweries If, as the crow flies, like three and a half miles apart, it's close, you can literally pour a beer.

Speaker 1: 43:18

drive to your other location, come back and you would still have good ahead of you.

Speaker 3: 43:22

Absolutely so. We thought it would kind of tell a story as well of hey, we're all in this together, there's not any hard feelings. So we actually ran back different variants of the beers called Second and Hudson. It changes every year so we've actually ran that back a few times. Ok, the first year, the second year. We didn't get to it last year but we'll get back to it this year for sure of doing the next edition of Second and Hudson. We did that. Let's see Fast forward. We did a serious bucket list collaboration with Lost 40 in Little Rock and I think it's the most unique collaboration idea I have ever seen. Maybe I'm biased, but we brewed five barrels of beauty guard wart at my place, ok, straight off of the boil kettle. We transferred it to chill it down and then kegged. It. Didn't pitch yeast, ok, we put the eggs to Lost 40 in Little Rock and they pumped them into barrels and then added yeast.

Speaker 1: 44:30

So what was the vision kind of that you had going into that?

Speaker 3: 44:34

So the vision wasn't flavor focused, it was concept focus of start here in there. Ok, so we brewed it here and then they finished the fermentation and packaging there over a year and a half later. Really, it was called Buddy's System. They came out in October of 2020. And it was just one of the most unique beers I've ever seen. I know the state of Arkansas was really proud of it, as one of the smallest brands and the biggest brand from two different markets came together and made a true. Once it's gone, it's gone. You can't replicate this product, so I did that one. After I opened Hockmoth, I had set a bucket list of wanting to brew a collaboration with Great Raft.

Speaker 1: 45:25

OK.

Speaker 3: 45:25

They're in Shreveport. It's about six hours south. I kind of have always circled them as the gold standard of regional brands. As far as the states that touch Arkansas, I think Great Raft and Shreveport is just, they're just kings.

Speaker 1: 45:39

So like if you could do one collaboration, that would be like one that you haven't done yet. That would be like your pinnacle right there. So I did a collaboration with them.

Speaker 3: 45:49

This is all a wild story. So I was able to go down to Shreveport and we brewed a Kvaik IPA there. This would have been in August of 2020. That was a quick turnaround, probably like four weeks from brew day to releasing the packaging. But yeah, it felt really, really cool to have my brand and my name attached to Great Raft, who I respect a lot. Fast forward a little bit. I actually, in February of 2020, right before pandemic hit I brewed a collaboration with Bicrack before we had official merger talks. We brewed an Irish stout to kind of be the Benton County's St Patty's go to beer. That was just the focus. It's a community driven beer for a specific weekend. The weekend ended up not happening, but the beer was still really cool. I had some of that beer, by the way.

Speaker 1: 46:51

It was absolutely cool.

Speaker 3: 46:52

It was just simply an Irish stout done well 4.5%, super dry, a little bit of faint mint character, along with all the roasted chocolate of thank Guinness or any of that. So I did that. I've got to do one with 405. We talk about it every month and back and forth. Where's 405 out of 405 is Oklahoma City. That one is going to happen at some point. It's just getting it on the calendar and following through with it. That one's going to happen. My ultimate collaboration.

Speaker 1: 47:30

What's the crown on?

Speaker 3: 47:31

Let's go back to the source where the story of Hock Mothall started Portland, maine. Okay, oxbow.

Speaker 1: 47:38

I think, Oxbow.

Speaker 3: 47:39

They are the most inspirational brand for what my passion and my styles are Beer sets, saison, bearded guards, basically beers that are not popular. They're like cool, we want to brew these and they do them better than anyone in the world. So they're, I think, their owner brewer not sure exactly who this is. He's got North West Arkansas ties in some ways, so I feel like I'm going to push to make this happen. That, oxbow, we're doing this.

Speaker 1: 48:14

If you guys are listening or if anybody out there knows some contacts at Oxbow, then reach out. Let them know that we've got somebody who is ready and willing to.

Speaker 3: 48:24

The first level gears have already started turning on on trying to make that one happen, which would just be Because I want to you're tweeting.

Speaker 1: 48:34

you're tweeting them every day, aren't you?

Speaker 3: 48:37

Yeah, something, I'm sending them Tiktoks every day.

Speaker 1: 48:42

That's what it is, as long as they're not cringy like Jackson the Holmes and we're good. But no, that's good man. So, oxbow, yeah, that's, that's really cool. Was there, would you say? There's one of their beers that really, just like that was your catalyst for, like holy smokes. These folks really know.

Speaker 3: 48:59

I think they were the first brand that showed me like, once it's gone, it's gone. Yeah, they, they have probably brewed it. They've probably been open for a decade and I bet they've brewed maybe a thousand different beers. Oh wow, they just brew so much stuff that whenever you go, just get whatever the bartender recommends that you get and Enjoy it and then move on. So, yeah, I'd have to go back and see like what all I had but they have a kind of their usually around flagship is a farmhouse pale ale. But it is. It is a sour saison, I would say, but they they listed as a farmhouse pale ale. It's, it's, I think, barrel fermented, and you just get so much character so quickly in doing that. When you can find that bottle or draft, it's always ten out of ten.

Speaker 1: 49:48

Okay, now you make me want to go make a road trip. Let's do this. Portland main is is a utopia I've never been.

Speaker 3: 49:54

It's. It's Before going there on my honeymoon. I had been to 46 states and I was lacking main in Montana and the two obvious and so we wanted to go to Maine, kind of add 47 and to establish all new memories. I had never been there. So let's see what that place was about. And since then I've gone back and it really is a utopia. That's awesome.

Speaker 1: 50:20

Awesome. Well, hopefully we can help make that happen here on the house, because I would love to see that and you know when they come to town. You just got to call me back and I'll come in here and do a podcast with you.

Speaker 1: 50:30

So, alright, let's move on to. I think we're gonna wrap up here, but I got a few random questions for you. These are rapid fire, so don't feel like you have to expand anything. You can tell as much or as little as you want to on these, okay, so so let's start out with what is, what is, your most treasured possession as? Far as a physical item, yeah, I mean, that shirt's pretty sweet, so this is a pretty cool in that one shirt.

Speaker 3: 50:57

I think as if we're doing rapid fire. First thing that pops in my head, whether it's right or wrong, I'm an avid coin collector, which is really nerdy and really strange. I didn't know that about. I've got a few really cool coins, like a 1921 piece dollar it's it's the coolest looking coin I have and I think it's my most treasured possession.

Speaker 1: 51:19

Awesome.

Speaker 3: 51:20

okay, I don't know I'm sure if I put four minutes of thought into it I'd come up with something real, but it was the first thing that popped in my head brewing in coin collection.

Speaker 1: 51:28

I love it. That's fantastic when yeah, she gave you a look just so you know. Yeah. So when you die, what do you want to be remembered for?

Speaker 3: 51:38

Hmm, mm-hmm, I would like to be Be remembered as an individual who encouraged others. It's something that we can never do too much of and I, every single day, fall short of, but I do want to be remembered as that, if that's what you're asking. Yeah, that's what I'm striving for.

Speaker 1: 52:00

I I fell out at miserably nine times out of ten, but there's there's power in that, so well, and especially in today's climate, I think it's really, really exciting actually to encourage other people, because not a lot of people are doing it. Yeah, be that difference, right, I think so. All right, let's knock out like two more. Okay, so what? At this point? I know we talked about Oxbow, but if you had to say a person, is there a living person that you admire the most right now in the beer industry? Is that what you're asking? I mean, you could. You could talk about our illustrious leader here.

Speaker 3: 52:37

I went beer industry. Um, business being a beer podcast, I would love to as far as like people goes. It doesn't count if you see someone and take a picture with them. Yeah, that doesn't count. Who do I want to have a beer with? So who can I get 30 minutes with and ask them questions like this that are either Deep or super shallow and funny? I would love to have a Sierra Nevada paleo with King Grossman. Okay, he's, he is all of mountain rush more. He's all four spots to me of og craft beer. I would love to pick his brain of. There's no way. 50 years ago he thought it would be this. There's this. That's not a possible vision to have. Well, 50 years from now, I want to be Twice as big as any craft brewery in the world, and that's what they are. Um, the quality is never wavered. They treat their employees Well. I he is a pretty inspiring dude that I would. I would love to have a beer with that's awesome.

Speaker 1: 53:39

I I think that's a fantastic one. You know, I said there was gonna be two more. I think it's a great one to end on right there, because it's it's super cool to see the heroes that we have and how. How have they impacted our lives, but, yeah, to see how their journey had been to. I would be so curious because he's done it all yeah which is kind of the reason, if you go back to it, why we're doing this podcast in the first place is because you guys are all heroes of mine.

Speaker 1: 54:07

I don't say that for you know frivolously here because I love beer and I love, I love the craft that you guys are Creating here and, as as the whole industry grows, it's just been really cool to see you guys come around, see the different flavors you can produce, the ways that you do collaborate, the ways that you do Just just re-engineer what we thought was possible with beer, and so I think that's really cool to see and I look forward to seeing everything that comes out, both here at heart, here at bike rack or over at Hawk moth, and any of your other future ventures that are coming.

Speaker 1: 54:42

Yes sir, yeah, it's gonna be exciting. So If people want to get ahold of you, where can they find you on a, on a regular?

Speaker 3: 54:50

Uh, the the brand, or me as an individual sure, why not? Yeah, let's say yes. Social media, it's, it's all there bike right brewing, hawk moth brewing. Instagram, twitter, facebook. I don't think we're doing Tiktok and snapchat yet, but who knows, by the time this comes out next week, that may be going to. So it's, it's. It's not hard to find people or brands anymore. It's if you have any effort at all, you will find what you need to.

Speaker 1: 55:19

Yeah well, and I guess my get my. My last real question that I have for you is will we see the Irish again this year? The Irish red, the Irish like it.

Speaker 3: 55:29

Irish red, irish red probably not. Irish stout this year we won't. We did it in 2020 and 2021 and both st Patties were just not real st Patties, yeah. So we kind of have a bad taste in our mouth associated with Putting a lot of marketing effort into this beard. That it's not the people's fault, but they just can't get out in droves and, yeah, pub crawl and all that. So Maybe, uh, when we're 100% free and clear, 2023. All right, we could circle back to it, all right.

Speaker 1: 56:01

Well, thanks so much for being here with us. Bradley appreciate it and, uh, we will see you guys next time, on the next episode of the brew house. Cheers. Hey, thanks again for listening to this episode of the brew house. I really appreciate you being here and I want to give you the Recognition that you so richly deserve being a follower. So do me a quick favor leave us a review here, on whatever platform you're listening on right now, and at the end of each new episode I'll be reading one or two of my favorites, so you might be able to hear your own review read soon. Thanks again, cheers, friends.

Speaker 2: 56:30

You've been listening to the brew house, a production of remnant media. Be sure to subscribe via apple podcast, spotify, google podcast or your other favorite podcasting platform so you don't miss another great episode. Thirsty for even more, follow us on youtube, instagram, facebook and even tiktok.